Sales Pipeline Radio, Episode 361: Q & A with Cristine Kao

Summary

In this episode of Sales Pipeline Radio, host Matt Heinz and guest Cristine Kao discuss the evolving role of the modern CMO, the importance of adaptability and strategic growth, and the impact of collaborative team sports on personal and professional development.

By Matt Heinz, President of Heinz Marketing

If you’re not already subscribed to Sales Pipeline Radio or listening live Thursdays at 11:30 am PT on LinkedIn (also on demand) you can find the transcription and recording here on the blog every Monday morning.  The show is less than 30 minutes, fast-paced and full of actionable advice, best practices and more for B2B sales and marketing professionals.

We cover a wide range of topics, with a focus on sales development and inside sales priorities.

This week’s show is entitled, “8 Jobs for Modern B2B CMOs“ and my guest is Cristine Kao, Chief Marketing Officer at ABC Fitness Solutions.

Tune in to:

• Discover the 8-10 multifaceted roles a CMO must embody today, from being a Revenue Accountable leader to a Strategic Growth Driver and everything in between.
• Gain Insights on how to adapt and pivot in a dynamic marketing environment without losing sight of your North Star.
• Understand the importance of maintaining a healthy, active lifestyle and how Cristine integrates this into her role at ABC Fitness.

Listen and/or Watch HERE and/or read the transcript below:

Welcome everybody to another episode of Sales Pipeline Radio. I’m your host, Matt Heinz. Very excited to have you all here as we get close to the end of July, hitting the dog days of summer. Hope y’all are enjoying a little bit of the season and wrapping up the month successfully as well. If you are watching us live today on LinkedIn, thank you so much for joining us on LinkedIn Live.

You have a chance to be on the show to be part of the show. If you give us a comment, we’ll be able to see that. We can react to it. We can put it up on screen. Love it when we get interaction with people that are able to watch live in the middle of their workday. So thank you so much for that. If you’re watching, listening on demand, thank you so much for downloading, for listening, for subscribing every episode of Sales Pipeline Radio, past, present, future, always available at salespipelineradio.com. Today, very excited to have with us the chief marketing officer of ABC fitness and we’re going to get to this also the head coach. of the I want to get this right, Dallas United Crew. We’re gonna get into that a little later. Cristine Kao. Cristine, thanks for joining us today.

Cristine: Hey Matt, how are you doing?

Matt: I am good, I am good. Well, I mean there’s so many things we could talk about on a lot of fronts, and we’ll get to a few of them, but the one thing I wanted to start with is just The role of the modern CMO in an organization and a lot of hats to wear and you shared with me something that you found, actually, I think your CEO forwarded to you recently around the eight roles, the modern CMO has.

So maybe just quick for people that don’t know you introduce yourself and then let me intro this concept of the eight jobs.

Cristine: Yeah. Well, thank you for having me, by the way, Matt, I’ve been a long-time listener. So very excited to be participating live for the first time. So. Amazing to be here.

Yes. First of all, I want to give a shout out to my CEO, Bill Davis of ABC Fitness Solutions. He was the one who forwarded me this article written by, Ravi Rupre and it’s a very much of a PE backed newsletter and I’ve been in the PE world for the last three rounds now.

So I thought this was something fun for us to talk about the modern CMO needs to be eight things. Again, not three, not four, eight. Revenue Accountable, a Sales Leader, a Customer Journey Designer, a Brand Builder, Pricing Committee Member, Strategic Growth Driver Corporate Development Officer, as well as a Financial Steward.

Just a few things, right?

Matt: A couple, just a couple. Yeah.

Cristine: Just a couple. I’m sure other folks will have a few more. I personally have two more to add as well, but boy, what a List of eight things to get started with.

Matt: Well, it’s interesting because I think you can get, I mean, you can get tired just thinking about all those different things you have to do.

But my reaction to that is like, okay, like some of these seem a little more tactical, but I like the idea that we want a CMO to be a strategic growth driver. We want them to be a financial steward, a corporate development officer. Like this is not something the arts and crafts person does in an organization.

So as you expand those jobs and elevate the responsibility there. I think that’s a good thing for the CMO role in general. What do you think?

Cristine: Absolutely. I would add that this is not unique to a PE environment, this is very much applicable to any modern marketer that you have to be adaptive, right?

And agile to the various things that the business needs and you modulate between these eight roles. You know, I suspect in the PE (private equity) environment, revenue accountable will always probably be number one, right? How do you get to the rule of 40 versus, you know maybe some of more consumer brands or other brands are more about brand and storytelling, product marketing.

I really do think it’s not you have to do it all at the same time, but rather how do you prioritize accordingly to the business need?

Matt: You said you wanted to add two more things to the list. What were your additions?

Cristine: So again, I’m a big believer in more of a mission led type of company and so I’d be remiss not to add cultural champion as a CMO, as well as I’m a fan of also alliteration is a product pundit. You have to know, especially in the world of product led growth now, which is we’re seeing more and more of you have to really be obsessed with the customer and buyer journey.

Matt: Absolutely. It’s, honestly, a buyer journey. It’s a user journey as a Brent Adamson sometimes talks about it as a, like, don’t screw things up journey, right? Like, as we go about our day, just trying not to, like, disrupt things. It’s a mindset, right? If you take that imposter syndrome with the protecting the status quo, keeping those things come together, it’s important to keep those in mind as well.

We’re talking today on Sales Pipeline Radio with Cristine Kao. She is the Chief Marketing Officer of ABC Fitness. And you mentioned, having done a few tours of duty in private equity land, which is unique, right? This is not startup land, venture capital, private equity is somewhat of a different thing, but you cut your teeth in a lot of healthcare space.

She’s been over eight years at GE Healthcare, not a startup. Talk a little bit about going from a global enterprise megacorp like GE and getting into private equity land. What were you able to bring from your experience that was a benefit? And what were some of the new lessons that you had to learn or new skills to build to be successful with a earlier stage company?

Cristine: Oh, wow. Man, that’s a throwback. It’s GE healthcare for me was more than a decade ago. You know, the one thing that I really appreciated about GE as a whole, at least in the late 90s, early 2000s was the obsession around Six Sigma and operational efficiency. This is where I really got a firsthand experience into operational design and using data and system and process to design– whether that’s change management to any discipline for that matter. And so I still find myself today applying a lot of that Six Sigma lean thinking into everything I do. And I think that has helped me in the PE environment where, you know, very technical, very process driven, right?

Oftentimes you have to build things from the startup, right? So People Process and Technology is your three pillars always when you effectuate any change. And so I find myself applying a lot of that still in the world today. And again, being comfortable with data and processes has, I think, helped me a long way.

Matt: So you’re kind of in a unique position to be able to speak from direct first hand experience about Six Sigma, pragmatic marketing, agile, right? Are those overlapped or do they build on each other or how do you think about and how do you in your own, way you operate combine elements of the three that work best for you?

Cristine: And we’re getting philosophical now, Matt. I love it. But that’s the funny part, isn’t it? That modern marketing now is not just your traditional marketing. In fact, in that newsletter that we were just talking about from, from Ravi, he opened that with, it’s a shift from a role focused on building brand awareness and vanity metrics.

Again, his words, not mine, to more of a revenue powerhouse responsible for direct revenue impact and the bottom line. And so when I think about all the things that I’ve had exposure to, whether that’s Six Sigma, to Pragmatic, to Agile it all contributed to appreciation for a couple of things in my mind, one is this idea of being able to adapt to rate the mix of the business and the maturity of different things.

Second, I would say I really got comfortable with iterative learning, right? You, fail fast, learn fast and getting into more of a sprint cycle and be comfortable testing always for anything you do.

And then I would say, the one thing that I took away from Agile, especially, I applied some of the Agile design and team design. We now have squads in marketing and in that concept of squad, you know, having always obviously a business partner to kind of help develop initiatives and programs, but bringing the best of different expertise within the team at a moment in time as a squad has helped us very much along the way of how we scale over time, as well as being efficient because we’re always strapped for resources, right?

So with the few resources that we have, how do we bring a squad together to be very concentrated and very impactful a quarter at a time. So again, most of all, I think, again, marketing is bringing view of technology and process, I think has been a great addition to the arsenal, if you will.

Matt: Yeah, I agree with that especially if you’ve got eight to 10 jobs as a CMO, and if you have those jobs and your team’s trying to execute on some of that strategy and vision as well I think knowing what you need to get done, being disciplined enough to get that work done efficiently, but also be open to new ideas, right? And some of those ideas, some of those new things are pivots, right? You start the year with a plan. Here’s what we’re going to go do. Some of it works. Some of it doesn’t; you can’t just stick with the plan if it’s suboptimal. So you make pivots, but then new ideas come in. You weren’t so clairvoyant at the beginning of the year you knew everything that was going to happen. So how do you lead and then manage it and encourage a team when things are always kind of changing, and you kind of need to adapt to that over time?

Cristine: We often joke that we all should have that friend’s shirt with the couch pivot.

I feel like at least in the PE world and especially now in marketing, we all should be wearing that shirt on a daily. You know, I’m a big fan of long-range planning and I’m sure a lot, all the companies do it. And reason why I start with that is because you have to have a plan with an end in mind.

And in my mind, the pivots and the priorities may change. The input of these things may change. For example, what you did last month may not work again this month.

Matt: Right.

Cristine: And it happens a lot. And so how do you pivot from there? But directionally, you should never steer away from your North Star. And if you find yourself departing from that path, boy, that’s an immediate conversation with your executive leadership team, your CEO and your board to, course-correct, to validate.

And that’s where I think folks can maybe get stuck or get caught up in the pivot. Meaning constantly changing what feels like direction, but when in reality is in my mind, it’s more about course correct to the same North Star that the rest of your team is also running towards.

Matt: Yeah. And I think context on that is important because if people don’t understand the context of why you’re making this pivot, they’re like, this is a rudderless ship, right? Like we don’t know where we’re going and we’re just making things up and trying to find a new way of doing it. So I think sometimes over communicating… someone told me once they said, every one of your employees has an enormous bowl, right? And your job is to fill that bowl with information and context. And if you don’t provide that, if you don’t over communicate, they’re going to fill that bowl on their own. And you may not like what they put in it and what they put in other people’s bowls as well. So sometimes the truth is not always like a fun story to tell, but if the truth is the truth, I think the people you want on the boat, in the boat with you, in the bus, whatever transportation analogy you want to use, they’re going to appreciate the openness. They’re going to appreciate that yeah, things do change. And let’s just start rowing in the same direction.

Cristine: Yeah, I know it’s cheesy, but it’s true. If, people understand the why behind it they will move along with you in the same direction for sure. And I think you’re trying to segue to my dragon boating experience.

Matt: You think you’re trying to like talk about rowing the boat in one direction and going to talk about this…

I’m looking at LinkedIn, this long history of boat clubs, and I’m always impressed by like smart, successful people that also have an investment in significant things outside and this is clearly a through line for you. So can you talk a little bit about where your passion for, I don’t want to call it boating because that’s not fair because it’s not like, this is not yacht club, right?

Cristine: No it’s a boating club.

Matt: Where did that come from and why is it so important to you?

Cristine: You know as we were just talking about the why one of the things I’ve really enjoyed over the years was actually coaching people, helping them find their passion and, and achieve what was thought impossible.

I have worked with breast cancer survivors. I’ve worked with teenagers. I’ve worked with senior adults as old as 80, who never thought they could compete in a team as an adult, and they did. The best feeling in the world, really. they look at you with that just a pure satisfaction of knowing that they’ve done something that they couldn’t do a year ago or two years ago.

It’s pure joy for me. And so as an athlete also in transitioning to coach. That’s something I really enjoyed outside of work and I tell you though, Matt, if you’ve never been on water in a kayak or a canoe or whatever, I encourage you to do so. There’s something about the sea life, the salt the water is pure, pure meditational for me.

it’s cleansing and it’s calming. It’s the best way to honestly to distress as well.

Matt: I’ve done that, but only recreationally, right? Not when I’m trying to get somewhere as fast as possible. I was a big fan of The Boys in the Boat. It was a super interesting story when it first came out. I went to University Washington, that boat house is still there. It’s in fact, they’re doing a whole fundraising around trying to get it renovated and keep it there forever. And I got a friend who we worked at a startup and he was an alternate in the Olympic rowing team back in the day.

And he just talks about what it means just in terms of tenacity and mental acuity throughout life. And honestly, he came to us as a sales rep with zero experience. But we’re like, I think the mental makeup of an Olympic alternate is going to be okay. And he became a sales leader. Surprise, surprise, very quickly.

Sine the pandemic, it’s a lot easier for people just to like sit in our basements and work from home and still have these insular lives. Can you talk about the importance of like getting out, not only getting on the water, but doing with other people that are trying to pursue a similar sort of challenge?

Cristine: Yeah, and the fact that I could do that with my company now as well, which is A jelling, an interlock of best life and interests, if you will. You know, the one thing that I am a firm believer of is that, health and family always comes first for that reason.

I’m a breast cancer survivor. I’ve had health scares. My family has gone through a lot of things and I’m really a fan of active lifestyle as a preventative way to living longer, living healthier, enjoying your life. And you’re right. It is easy nowadays, especially after COVID, right? to simply stay home and do nothing. And this is why I think a team sport has been transformational for me is that when you have a human connection; whether you’re at the gym or you’re on the water with your team, that sense of connection and community is so important nowadays. And that’s not something you could replace with watching TikTok or Instagram or being on screen or even just a virtual interaction, I suppose, like this.

And in ABC Fitness Solutions and not to plug for the company, we help 40 million people around the world doing exactly that– finding healthier habits and, and exercise that makes them happy. And so I can’t encourage everybody enough to, even if it’s just 10 minutes walking. One step more is then what you had yesterday, so start small and next thing, you know, you will be running marathons.

Matt: We’ve all got to pay bills and there’s a lot of places we can go to work to do that, but there’s a lot to be said for places you can do that, that are purpose mission driven, right? That are trying to do something different in the world.

You don’t have to change the world entirely, but if you have an impact on a few other people, that’s meaningful, right? You still take your money home, but you also know that you’re doing something good for the world overall.

Christine, thank you so much for joining us today. Really appreciate it. Glad you are open to us veering off into a little bit of philosophical as well as talk about paddling as well. So, thanks again for doing this.

Cristine: Absolutely. Thank you for having me again. Look forward to connecting with folks online and as a CMO community, I look forward to hearing from folks what else you think we should add to the list of the eight?

Matt: Absolutely. Awesome. Well thanks everyone. We’re gonna be on hiatus for the next couple weeks. I’m on vacation with the family for a couple weeks. We’ll be back mid-August with more episodes. Until then, thank you so much. Enjoy your summer. We’ll see you next time on Sales Pipeline Radio.

Matt interviews the best and brightest minds in sales and Marketing.  If you would like to be a guest on Sales Pipeline Radio send an email to Sheena@heinzmarketing.com.